I guess that we were well prepared for the bureaucracy after reading articles and posts about it, but, so far, we have not run into anything that can rival Motor Vehicles Commission in multiple states in the US. At least the people here are trying to help and, in Madeira, everyone has been kind and patient with us. Think how frustrating we are to them!
Nancy, I share your pain, the bureaucracy is painful.
However, I would like to share a tip that WORKED FOR ME (and I say it this way because a good friend vehemently disagrees with me on this).
When trying to phone SEF from my mobile, I too was never able to get through.
But within 3 attempts using a landline, I succeeded!
For the sake of completeness, that first time I got through did not get me the desired appointment, because when I asked if they spoke English I got cut off - but it WAS late in the day.
When I called again the next business day, I also got through within 2-3 tries.
Not wanting to take any chances, this time I did not ask for an English speaker, I just battled my way through, using my limited Portuguese. But I probably would have been helped in English that morning if I had. I was given an appointment for a few weeks later.
So my advice is, if you have a landline (and if you have a fibre account, you are almost guaranteed to have a line, you might just need to find a cheap handset/ borrow one to use with it) then call their landline number from that.
But again... "YMMV".
Tip number 2: It took seven weeks after my appointment for the new card to arrive. So you will likely need to renew the temporary anyway, but this should not be a big deal at all.
This then raises the question of should you even bother trying before your permit renewal? Well, since you mentioned following rules, you should technically report any change of address within (I think) 90 days, so whether this becomes an issue when you renew is something to discuss with your consultant..
I’ve started assuming that nothing will happen the first time...by the third attempt I try to imagine what it’s like for immigrants in the United States; that usually helps my perspective. But yeah... And I don’t think there’s another European country that allows Americans to exchange their license without taking the driving and written exams (and in some countries the entire course.) 🤷🏻♀️
Bank card to work properly has been an ongoing situation. We go back again this morning for the 3rd time. Fingers crossed.
David brought up a great point. This country has honestly only been on its own for maybe 35 years. They only put in road infrastructure in the 90’s... so, they are all still figuring it out. It’s frustrating for us all, but knowing that fact, that yes, this is a “new” country does help keep things in perspective.
They're tight about things and I was frustrated at 1st but now I like the security. I lost my card 2X not understanding how to get money. It's the button on the upper left that translates into
"Survey" that is the way in and know your pin.
Using the card online has a 2X confirmation that took me a while to get but now I appreciate it. fyi
It's always frustrating to run into issues, especially when it's us and our mistakes that have caused the issue! Hundreds of experiences shared at Americans and FriendsPT that would have informed you of the requirement to change the residence address directly with SEF, and the secrets to getting through to SEF. MOST importantly, you're staying in Portugal and are so close to moving in to your home...the address you will use for your residence cards!
I feel this frustration. Bureaucracy driving me insane and knowing my stories are a walk in the park compared to people who come from developing nations is one of the motivational forces behind my Without Borders project. I hope that through people sharing all their stories about bureaucracy and how ridiculous, slow, backward, classist and racist the process often is, it will create more initiative for bureaucracy to change.
Here in Spain, I was allowed to rent a car with my Canadian driver's license until I became a resident here. Riddle me that!
The bureaucracy also makes me consider leaving, but then I focus on all the good and the fact that the paperwork does eventually come to an end... Well, it never comes to an end, but it decreases once you’ve got the main things out of the way.
Been there! Kitchen cabinets stocked with chill pills.:-). Feeling you Nancy. And also living your question. So far, eighteen months after SEF, and having turned 70 this year, home state license & International driver’s license through AAA, has sufficed during two on the road meet ups with GNR. As in all bureaucracy, seems to come down to who is in front of me at the moment. For this I’m most grateful. Boa tarde!
OMG!!! I can sooooo relate! I am in the midst of bureaucratic stonewalling by Financas & SEF. The start date on my NHR is wrong & I can't get anyone to talk to me or help. Also.. I am in Cascais & moved from one location to another. I went to SEF in Cascais to ask for an appointment & they said I must call .... the same # that doesn't get answered. I sent an e-mail & they said I must call... the same # that doesn't get answered. Some days I want to five up up instead I tell myself that I am getting lessons in patience... and I try again. Keep Calm & Carry on!!
Good luck &hang in there!! I have faith that we will all be able to look back on these not so fun experiences & laugh about them... one day ... even if not today.
We are also working through IMT hell and can sympathize with your situation. My husband and I submitted our paperwork to IMT at the same time and both application packets had similar documents. We submitted online and then went in person to the Faro office for our assigned appointment times (thankfully same day and close enough in time!). We both got a paper temporary license. I got my permanent one a few weeks later. My husband got an email asking for additional documents. The problem was the “additional documents” are documents he already provided *sigh*. Long story short and the reason I’m telling you this, his temporary license expired but we went to the IMT office and they gave him a 6-months extension. That was apparently no problem as long as they are still “working on” his application. Hopefully Denise can get an extension if needed. We spoke to people in the waiting area who have had several extensions....
Appreciate your sense of humor...when presented with obstacles/hardships you can either be angry and still have to deal with the issues, or make the best of it and still have to deal with the issues! Glad you choose to look at this as a good story and get a laugh!
You got this Nancy. One of the things I most appreciated while working for you was your ability to eliminate bureaucratic obstacles that hampered my ability to be effective at my job. I always admired that skill and to this day could never quite get to your level.
What a story!!! My heart fell first, thinking the worst - you’ve decided to leave PT. Heck, bureaucracy is a curse. I’m happy I got another valuable advice to have a replacement DL. Thanks so much, Nancy
Nancy, we are six months (and counting) away from moving to Ribamar (Lourinha) from the US. All of your writings and rants are 1000% relevant and useful to our situation - retired female couple negotiating a brave new life in Portugal. Thanks a million for doing this and sharing it with all of us!
I have said to myself a few times, they make the process so easy to get over here then laugh at us as they make us jump through hoops, run circles, and pull our hair out!
We surrender our DL months ago then on our return to the states recently we lied a tiny bit and applied for replacements. Fingers crossed.
I guess that we were well prepared for the bureaucracy after reading articles and posts about it, but, so far, we have not run into anything that can rival Motor Vehicles Commission in multiple states in the US. At least the people here are trying to help and, in Madeira, everyone has been kind and patient with us. Think how frustrating we are to them!
Nancy, I share your pain, the bureaucracy is painful.
However, I would like to share a tip that WORKED FOR ME (and I say it this way because a good friend vehemently disagrees with me on this).
When trying to phone SEF from my mobile, I too was never able to get through.
But within 3 attempts using a landline, I succeeded!
For the sake of completeness, that first time I got through did not get me the desired appointment, because when I asked if they spoke English I got cut off - but it WAS late in the day.
When I called again the next business day, I also got through within 2-3 tries.
Not wanting to take any chances, this time I did not ask for an English speaker, I just battled my way through, using my limited Portuguese. But I probably would have been helped in English that morning if I had. I was given an appointment for a few weeks later.
So my advice is, if you have a landline (and if you have a fibre account, you are almost guaranteed to have a line, you might just need to find a cheap handset/ borrow one to use with it) then call their landline number from that.
But again... "YMMV".
Tip number 2: It took seven weeks after my appointment for the new card to arrive. So you will likely need to renew the temporary anyway, but this should not be a big deal at all.
This then raises the question of should you even bother trying before your permit renewal? Well, since you mentioned following rules, you should technically report any change of address within (I think) 90 days, so whether this becomes an issue when you renew is something to discuss with your consultant..
Good luck and don't give up.
I’ve started assuming that nothing will happen the first time...by the third attempt I try to imagine what it’s like for immigrants in the United States; that usually helps my perspective. But yeah... And I don’t think there’s another European country that allows Americans to exchange their license without taking the driving and written exams (and in some countries the entire course.) 🤷🏻♀️
Oh, also, getting my Millennium
Bank card to work properly has been an ongoing situation. We go back again this morning for the 3rd time. Fingers crossed.
David brought up a great point. This country has honestly only been on its own for maybe 35 years. They only put in road infrastructure in the 90’s... so, they are all still figuring it out. It’s frustrating for us all, but knowing that fact, that yes, this is a “new” country does help keep things in perspective.
They're tight about things and I was frustrated at 1st but now I like the security. I lost my card 2X not understanding how to get money. It's the button on the upper left that translates into
"Survey" that is the way in and know your pin.
Using the card online has a 2X confirmation that took me a while to get but now I appreciate it. fyi
It's always frustrating to run into issues, especially when it's us and our mistakes that have caused the issue! Hundreds of experiences shared at Americans and FriendsPT that would have informed you of the requirement to change the residence address directly with SEF, and the secrets to getting through to SEF. MOST importantly, you're staying in Portugal and are so close to moving in to your home...the address you will use for your residence cards!
I feel this frustration. Bureaucracy driving me insane and knowing my stories are a walk in the park compared to people who come from developing nations is one of the motivational forces behind my Without Borders project. I hope that through people sharing all their stories about bureaucracy and how ridiculous, slow, backward, classist and racist the process often is, it will create more initiative for bureaucracy to change.
Here in Spain, I was allowed to rent a car with my Canadian driver's license until I became a resident here. Riddle me that!
The bureaucracy also makes me consider leaving, but then I focus on all the good and the fact that the paperwork does eventually come to an end... Well, it never comes to an end, but it decreases once you’ve got the main things out of the way.
We recently learned that Denise's temporary PT license is not recognised by Spain. A €40 ticket if she is caught driving in Spain with it.
That’s frustrating. At least Spain has good public transit, so you’ll be able to get to a lot of places you wanna go.
Been there! Kitchen cabinets stocked with chill pills.:-). Feeling you Nancy. And also living your question. So far, eighteen months after SEF, and having turned 70 this year, home state license & International driver’s license through AAA, has sufficed during two on the road meet ups with GNR. As in all bureaucracy, seems to come down to who is in front of me at the moment. For this I’m most grateful. Boa tarde!
OMG!!! I can sooooo relate! I am in the midst of bureaucratic stonewalling by Financas & SEF. The start date on my NHR is wrong & I can't get anyone to talk to me or help. Also.. I am in Cascais & moved from one location to another. I went to SEF in Cascais to ask for an appointment & they said I must call .... the same # that doesn't get answered. I sent an e-mail & they said I must call... the same # that doesn't get answered. Some days I want to five up up instead I tell myself that I am getting lessons in patience... and I try again. Keep Calm & Carry on!!
Good luck &hang in there!! I have faith that we will all be able to look back on these not so fun experiences & laugh about them... one day ... even if not today.
We are also working through IMT hell and can sympathize with your situation. My husband and I submitted our paperwork to IMT at the same time and both application packets had similar documents. We submitted online and then went in person to the Faro office for our assigned appointment times (thankfully same day and close enough in time!). We both got a paper temporary license. I got my permanent one a few weeks later. My husband got an email asking for additional documents. The problem was the “additional documents” are documents he already provided *sigh*. Long story short and the reason I’m telling you this, his temporary license expired but we went to the IMT office and they gave him a 6-months extension. That was apparently no problem as long as they are still “working on” his application. Hopefully Denise can get an extension if needed. We spoke to people in the waiting area who have had several extensions....
hang in there!!! We’re rooting for you!
Very funny 🤣 posting, however frustrating
Wow. . I am surprised and disappointed at this post. I thought you guys really seemed to have it together.
Nope!
Appreciate your sense of humor...when presented with obstacles/hardships you can either be angry and still have to deal with the issues, or make the best of it and still have to deal with the issues! Glad you choose to look at this as a good story and get a laugh!
You got this Nancy. One of the things I most appreciated while working for you was your ability to eliminate bureaucratic obstacles that hampered my ability to be effective at my job. I always admired that skill and to this day could never quite get to your level.
What a story!!! My heart fell first, thinking the worst - you’ve decided to leave PT. Heck, bureaucracy is a curse. I’m happy I got another valuable advice to have a replacement DL. Thanks so much, Nancy
Nancy, we are six months (and counting) away from moving to Ribamar (Lourinha) from the US. All of your writings and rants are 1000% relevant and useful to our situation - retired female couple negotiating a brave new life in Portugal. Thanks a million for doing this and sharing it with all of us!
I feel your pain and angst!
I have said to myself a few times, they make the process so easy to get over here then laugh at us as they make us jump through hoops, run circles, and pull our hair out!
We surrender our DL months ago then on our return to the states recently we lied a tiny bit and applied for replacements. Fingers crossed.